101. bubbaette - July 16, 1999 - 11:54 AM PT
i saw a bio of lucy in her later years and she was a bitter ol hag. desi aged much better.
102. MsIvoryTower - July 16, 1999 - 12:00 PM PT
Hmm, that's interesting. What was the bitterness from I wonder?
In any case, my original comment about her humor was confined to her Lucy years, so I don't think we disagree.
What's interesting is that both she and Desi were less funny and dynamic apart, in later years, than they were together on the Lucy show. Whatever was happening between them worked like a charm on that show and was never repeated again.
103. Jenerator - July 16, 1999 - 12:02 PM PT
Did any of you see the special on Kaufman and his obsession with the professional wrestler? The man was WEIRD.
104. JJBiener - July 16, 1999 - 12:03 PM PT
I know it is heretical to say, but I never liked Lucy. I just never got her brand of humor.
I liked Andy Kaufman's early stuff like foreign man becomes elvis and the Mighy Mouse theme. His later stuff left me cold.
Carol Kane, however, is one of my all time favorites. I liked her in Taxi. I thought she was great in Princess Bride with Billy Crystal. She was hilarious as the Ghost of Christmas Present in Scrooged with Bill Murray. She was perfect as an former hippie in Flashback with Keifer Sutherland.
105. ChristinO - July 16, 1999 - 12:06 PM PT
Uncle Fester is the name you're searching for.
I like Carol Kane but she's less funny at times than others. I loved her as the Ghost of Christmas Past in Scrooged when she keeps 'accidentally' beating the shit out of Michael Keaton by her clutziness all the while apologizing insincerely in that stupid fairy voice with the lisp. That cracks me up.
She was great as the grandmother in The Addams Family (It may have been Addams Family Values) and I loved her in The Princess Bride. She has pretty much one schtick but she does it well and when it's appropriate to the film it makes me laugh every time.
106. ChristinO - July 16, 1999 - 12:08 PM PT
GAAAAAAH!
Great cross-post!
You're right! It was Bill Murray and she's the Ghost of Christmas Present. Doesn't she bean him in the head with a toaster or an iron or something?
107. ChristinO - July 16, 1999 - 12:12 PM PT
Present Physical Comedy Guys: Steve Martin, John Ritter--one of the best, Tom Hanks----remember before he became a "serious" actor how incredibly funny he was?---Jim Carey
I'm wracking my brain trying to think of any women who do slapstick. Carol Kane.........uhm.....Carol Kane........and then there's...Carol Kane.....
108. jonesatlaw - July 16, 1999 - 12:57 PM PT
Women slapstick- Penny Marshall and Cindy Williams(?) in Laverne and Shirley. Some of their stuff was reminiscent of Stan and Ollie. At their best they were wonderful, and that was usually when they were doing physical bits.
109. JJBiener - July 16, 1999 - 1:03 PM PT
Christin - If you like Carol Kane, you have to see her in Flashback. She was excellent. Dennis Hopper had a line in that movie (c1989) that I find amazing. He said, "The 90's are going to make the 60's look like 50's." In many things that line ended up being true.
110. CalGal - July 16, 1999 - 1:05 PM PT
Actually, Laverne and Shirley were not just reminiscent but deliberately a copy of Lucy and Ethel.
111. CalGal - July 16, 1999 - 1:07 PM PT
I like movies that are hysterically funny without ever seeming to break a sweat.
Local Hero
Monkey Business
Desk Set
112. rickc2000 - July 16, 1999 - 1:18 PM PT
Local Hero was laugh out loud hilarious. But them most of his movies have their very funny bits. Kathleen Turner does good physical comedy.
113. ChristinO - July 16, 1999 - 1:19 PM PT
Carol Burnette is very good with physical comedy too, but I still can't think of any female comedian who is primarily a physical comedy person.
I wonder if it's part of that mysterious "Women don't like The 3 Stooges" thing? I haven't seen the Stooges in years, but I loved them up through my teen years. Maybe it would be different now, but I don't want to lose that warm feeling I get when I think of them so I purposely haven't gone back and tested the theory that grown women don't 'get' the stooges.
114. ACEofSPADES - July 16, 1999 - 1:21 PM PT
JJ:
Wow, did you just see Flashback on HBO, too?
It's a good flick-- surprisingly so, especially given HBO's rather poor (IMHO) record at making movies.
115. ChristinO - July 16, 1999 - 1:26 PM PT
Rick,
Yes she does, as do Shelley Duval and Joan Cusak. But they are not slapstick comedians.
John Ritter will ALWAYS trip over something, Tom Hanks will always get knocked over or hit in the head with something heavy, Carey's lunatic grin itself is slapstick even without all the contortions of his body, Steve Martin is another stumbler: These guys are funny in other ways as well, but they are based in the goofiness of slapstick. Their very essense is physicality.
JJ,
I'm trying to think if I ever saw Flashback, but I think it was one of those that I meant to and didn't get around to. I'll try and pick it up on video!
116. MsIvoryTower - July 16, 1999 - 1:31 PM PT
There were several physical comediennes in the 30's, 40's and 50's, so I don't think it's that women don't like physical comedy, but that there have been few women who have gone in that direction in the modern era.
For instance, Ginger Rodgers, Judy Garland, Lucille Ball, Carol Lombarde, Claudette Cobert, and a bunch of women whose names I can't remember but whose faces I can see as well, all used physical comedy as part of their comedic presence on the screen.
Perhaps Goldie Hawn is about the only one I can think of that has some films with physical comedy in them routinely.
I agree about the Raquel Welch/Three Musketeers comments, she was completely unexpected as a klutz in that film, and I think that's part of why it worked so well.
117. Wombat - July 16, 1999 - 1:39 PM PT
Wombat's laugh fest:
Physical Comedians: Ellen DeGeneres, John Ritter.
Monty Python
The hangover scene in Philadelphia Story
All of Arsenic and Old Lace
The Ealing Studio films with Alec Guinness and Peter Sellers: I'm All Right Jack, Kind Hearts and Coronets, The Lavender Hill Mob, The Ladykillers
The Great Dictator (except the last scene)
French Slapstick: Mr. Hulot's Holiday, The Crazy Adventures of Rabbi Jacob, La Cage au Folles, The Tall Blond Man with One Black Shoe
118. CalGal - July 16, 1999 - 1:49 PM PT
Oh, my god, The Tall Blond Man with One Black Shoe.
There's a character who was mercilessly abused--the little husband of the woman he was having an affair with. He kept finding bodies everywhere (in the refrigerator, for example) in that one scene? I haven't seen that movie since I was 12 or 13, but lordy, it was funny.
Movie comedies seem very much a male domain, these days. That may be why there are fewer physical comediennes.
119. ACEofSPADES - July 16, 1999 - 1:53 PM PT
"I agree about the Raquel Welch/Three Musketeers comments, she was completely unexpected as a klutz in that film, and I think that's part of why it worked so well."
The other part of why it worked so well, I'd say, would be the jugs. But that's just one guy's opinion.
120. CalGal - July 16, 1999 - 1:57 PM PT
Oh, no, the big jugs was what made the klutzy physical comedy so unexpected. And she did a *damn* good job at it. (As did her jugs)
Besides, the contrast between her warmth and goofy clumsiness and Milady's icy competence was superb.
I think, btw, that The Three Musketeers (and its followup) is one of the best adaptations of a novel ever put on screen and one of the funniest movies of the 70s.
121. arkymalarky - July 16, 1999 - 1:59 PM PT
Hey, nobody's mentioned Mr. Bean.
122. Wombat - July 16, 1999 - 2:03 PM PT
I first saw the Tall Blond Man...in college, when I was recovering from Mono. The Doctor had warned me that one of the lingering symptoms was an enlarged spleen, and that I should try to avoid things that might cause it to rupture, like laughing. I alternated between howling with laughter and terror that I might have to be rushed to the hospital.
123. ChristinO - July 16, 1999 - 2:05 PM PT
Wombat,
Yes on Ellen! Although her stand-up is not slapstick her movies certainly have been and much of her television show.
Cal,
You're right that Welch was even funnier because she was a hotty. Poor Heather Graham is a hotty but not the least bit funny in The Spy Who Shagged Me. Pardon my blasphemy here since I think Meyers is a superb writer, but WHAT can he have been thinking when he wrote her character? There is no tension in it whatsoever. Powers says "Let's Shag" and she says "Okay!" and strips scene over. Johnson as Ivanna Humpalot was much funnier because she was totally over the top. Shagwell doesn't have that option and consequently she's stuck in a pretty lame place throughout the entire film. The only really funny thing she does is flash the guard.
124. ChristinO - July 16, 1999 - 2:06 PM PT
Marilyn Monroe!
Another great comedienne who's beauty served to enhance her comedy.
125. ChristinO - July 16, 1999 - 2:06 PM PT
oh god.
whose.
126. ChristinO - July 16, 1999 - 2:07 PM PT
LOL! Wombat that's hysterical!!!
127. CalGal - July 16, 1999 - 2:10 PM PT
Wombat,
"I alternated between howling with laughter and terror that I might have to be rushed to the hospital."
I can well imagine!
You're not that much older than me--did you see it at a revival house? I just looked it up and I must have been 10 or 11. I'm pretty sure I saw it in England, of all places.
Christin,
Excellent point about Heather Graham. But then, I think the idea of the comic foil being the heroine has only been done by Raquel that one time.
128. ChristinO - July 16, 1999 - 2:14 PM PT
I'm semi-wracking my brain, but I think you may be right about that, CG.
129. Wombat - July 16, 1999 - 2:14 PM PT
Cal:
It was part of a student-council-funded film festival that showed a film every Friday. I was a senior.
Another in the Wombat Pantheon of Laughs: National Lampoon's Animal House
130. Aldavis - July 16, 1999 - 6:04 PM PT
There is such a wide range of humor. I love jokes if they are well told. Years ago on radio there was a program called "Can You Top This" where contestants sent in jokes which were then told by a professional. There was a live audience and their laughter was regestered on a laugh meter. Then several comdedians told jokes that tried to top the laughter. If if were extant today, I would send in the following joke.
An old fellow named Ed went to see his old friend Joe he had not seen for some time.
Well, Joe, what you been up to lately?
Oh, says Joe, I been over to the college taking me a memory course.
No kidding, says Ed. What do you do over there?
Well, they teach us all sorts of little ways we can improve our memory.
Is that a fact! What's the name of the course?
Oh now, let me see. What's the name of that flower with the long stem and thorns on it?
Do you mean a rose?
Yeah, that's it.
Now Joe turns to his wife and says
Hey Rose, what's the name of that damned course?
131. thoughtful - July 16, 1999 - 6:49 PM PT
Re physical humor, Dick Van Dyke was one of the best. I still enjoy the old reruns of his show with MTM. In case anyone remembers, the neighbor Millie is now Gramma Yetta on the Nanny.
Re females, I love Madeleine Kahn, especially in Young Frankenstein and one of my favorite funnies of all time, What's Up Doc with its incredible chase scene.
One of the best lines you almost miss because you're not expecting it was from Law & Order. They were looking for a felon to share a cell with the suspect in the hopes that the suspect would spill his guts. The DA Adam Schiff asks, "Who've you got." McCoy replies, "A landlord or an armed robber." Schiff, completely deadpan, responds, "Use the robber -- he'd get more sympathy with the jury."
132. thoughtful - July 16, 1999 - 6:57 PM PT
I confess I enjoy ethnic jokes. I have for years. Being Italian and Hungarian and Polish, I've been the brunt of many of them. We told them in our family a lot about our own ethnic groups and we all enjoyed them. I've not found them to be so mean or petty as most would think -- provided that they are funny, and that they are delivered by someone who bears no malice. The ethnic group slammed usually irrelevant. I think it was the Smothers Brothers who wanted to tell an ethnic joke, but not wanting to slam anyone, turned it into a Pygmy-Eskimo joke, at which point a short man in a parka comes out on stage and slugs them.
I find most of them now are converted into "occupational" jokes rather than ethnic...funny how replacing the ethnic group with "economists" seems to work well for most of them.
133. thoughtful - July 16, 1999 - 7:03 PM PT
A cop finds two economists walking stark naked, late at night, in the middle of a city street. He stops and asks what they are doing there. One replies, well, we were here for a convention and got invited to a party in a hotel room. Suddenly someone shouted, "Hey, let's turn the lights off," and the room went dark. Then someone shouted, "Take all your clothes off," so we did. Then someone else shouted, "OK everyone, let's go to town!"
So here we are!
134. joezan - July 16, 1999 - 7:57 PM PT
I gotta say - I never thought of inserting "economist" into ethnic jokes to take the edge off.
Lemme see how it works...
Ok...
There's these two economist junkies, squatting in a dark stairway, sharing a dirty needle, shooting some heroin.
Guy walks by. Says "Hey, you morons! Don't you know that's how you get AIDS???!!!"
Junkie looks up, smirks, and replies "Of course we know that! That's why we're wearing rubbers, you idiot!"
I don't know...
135. EricCartman1 - July 16, 1999 - 11:40 PM PT
"Another in the Wombat Pantheon of Laughs: National Lampoon's Animal House."
Yes! The blueprint for many a lesser comedy; what the imitators all missed was that it wasn't really about titties and beer (well, OK, it kinda was, but...). Like "Something About Mary", "Animal House" had characters worth rooting for -- everybody knew a Pinto, an Otter, or a Flounder at one time or another. Or they *were* one of those guys.
Me, I was Boon. Occasionally Bluto.
And Belushi's physicality as a comedian was extraordinary. The only person in recent years to even approach it was Chris Farley, ironically. It's so rare to see someone that willing to literally throw themselves into their role head-first. Jim Carrey does pretty well at it also.
136. EricCartman1 - July 16, 1999 - 11:46 PM PT
And now, the Eric Cartman Prime Time Variety Players proudly present:
_Every episode of "I Love Lucy" ever made!_
Fred & Ethel come over to Lucy & Ricky's place. Fred & Ricky take off, probably to find some chicks.
Lucy talks Ethel into doing something stupid, as a surprise for Ricky.
Ricky finds out and comes home fuming, little imaginary jets of steam pouring out from his miniature head.
Ricky: "Hey, Loo-sey, you got some 'splainin' to do!"
Lucy: "WAAAAAAHHHHHH!!!"
_THE END_
137. EricCartman1 - July 17, 1999 - 12:01 AM PT
AlDavis Message #130:
That memory course skit reminds me of a similar one by Firesign Theatre, a very underrated emsemble who occasionally approached Python-esque greatness and surrealism.
138. Slackjaw - July 17, 1999 - 12:07 AM PT
never understood what was so funny about Lucy. My wife *loves* the show but I cannot see the humor.
139. EricCartman1 - July 17, 1999 - 12:23 AM PT
Slackjaw:
Yeah, Lucy seems to be as much a woman thing as the 3 Stooges are a guy thing (I can handle 'em in limited doses). Never met a guy who was a fan of "I Love Lucy". Like "Gilligan's Island", every episode was a variation on the same theme.
Now, if they had put Mary Ann in "I Love Lucy", I might have liked it more.
140. cllrdr - July 17, 1999 - 8:08 AM PT
Glad you mentioned the Firesign Theater, Eric. After the Original Second City (Severn Darden, Alan Akin, Barbara Harris, Anthony Holland, etc.) and Nichols & May and Lenny Bruce, they were the most important Pre-Python touchstone for me.
Their masterpiece -- "Don't Touch That Dwarf! Hand me the Pliers" came out moments after Kent State. Without intending to it reflected the zeitgeist like nothing else I can name.
141. CalGal - July 17, 1999 - 8:31 AM PT
Well, I never really cared for Lucy *or* the Stooges. Although both of them had their moments. I was always a Vivian Vance fan, though.
142. judithathome - July 17, 1999 - 8:40 AM PT
I liked Dick Cavett when he had a show on TV back in the 70s (I think). He was very sly.
143. MsIvoryTower - July 17, 1999 - 9:58 AM PT
The gender thing about Lucy is interesting. I think her comedy is female oriented, the comedic moments are often those that capture a woman's world.
I was never a huge fan of hers, but both my sister and daughter simply adore her. And I agree she was at her best with Vivian Vance as sidekick (as her later spin offs indicate).
I never liked Gilligans Island, never. Never saw the point of it, never believed it possible, and rarely thought it humorous.
144. AdamSelene - July 17, 1999 - 10:04 AM PT
Did not like Lucy one bit. But I love dDharma and Greg, and the difference between Dharma and Lucy is everything.
Lucy: did stupid stuff, was embarrased about it, tried to hide it, never learned.
Dharma: does stupid stuff, is proud of it, everyone else learns.
Now, the BEST series would be: Dharma and Ellen. What a howl that would be!!!!
145. arkymalarky - July 17, 1999 - 10:07 AM PT
Aw, I love Gilligan's Island. The unbelievability, stupidity and predicitability is what makes it so funny. Dharma is a different story. She's just too terminally cute for my tastes.
146. CalGal - July 17, 1999 - 10:07 AM PT
Speaking of funny TV shows, I just LOVED The Monkees. In fact, the opening credits still make me laugh.
The first season in particular was marvellous.
I mentioned this once before, but there was a special on the formation of the Monkees and they showed Mike Nesmith's screen test. I wish I could remember the exact words, but you'll get the idea.
"Let's see you act angry."
"Okay." Nesmith takes a moment to prepare, and then looks at the camera with that ultra deadpan of his.
"Um", the voice giving orders is nonplussed. "Let's see you act like a happy little girl."
"Okay." Nesmith takes a moment to prepare, and then looks at the camera with that same ultra deadpan.
"But you looked exactly the same in both cases!" the voice expostulates.
"Hey, man, that's *your* problem."
147. MsIvoryTower - July 17, 1999 - 10:14 AM PT
I'll pass on Dharma and Greg, I think it a very boring show and tries *way* too hard to be something (I don't know what, but something).
There is little by the way of live TV that is funny to me right now. Currently, I think Southpark and Daria are the funniest thing on TV, although I did catch "That 70's Show" and thought it had some very funny moments. I've also looked in on "Strangers with Candy", and I don't see what's funny about that show at all.
148. AdamSelene - July 17, 1999 - 10:16 AM PT
"She's just too terminally cute for my tastes." ya - that's what I love about her. She's too cute for physical humor, but she does it anyway. I just love the (excuse the phrase, but it is exactly what I mean) balls of her character.
Hated Seinfeld. never got it. What's so interesting about a bunch of losers complaining about being losers?
Didn't like Frasier the first time around, I guess I didn't give it a chance. But --- now I really love Niles. Frasier alone can be too much, but Niles is absolutely perfect.
149. arkymalarky - July 17, 1999 - 10:18 AM PT
There's not a single sitcom on network tv that interests me right now.
150. AdamSelene - July 17, 1999 - 10:18 AM PT
MsIt,
Perhaps you missed the first few episodes of D&H? I'll grant that it's gotten uneven, but the first few episodes were priceless.
Anyway - favorite comedy movie of all time: Young Frankensteen. (Maybe I just like strong, loose women...)
151. arkymalarky - July 17, 1999 - 10:22 AM PT
"I just love the (excuse the phrase, but it is exactly what I mean) balls of her character."
You can see her working at it, and it seems to me she's conscious of her character, and that really annoys me in an actress.
I love Seinfeld, too. The shameless selfishness of those folks and their interaction with the people around them are hilarious to me. I loved it when George was trying to impress a girl with what a nice guy he was at a kids' birthday party until a fire broke out in the kitchen. Self-preservation trumped impressing a woman easily.
152. arkymalarky - July 17, 1999 - 10:23 AM PT
I love Young Frankenstein.
153. AdamSelene - July 17, 1999 - 10:29 AM PT
"I loved it when George was trying to impress a girl with what a nice guy he was at a kids' birthday party until a fire broke out in the kitchen. Self-preservation trumped impressing a woman easily."
See --- here's where my tastes seem to be at odds with the mainstream. People acting stupid while pretending to be something they're not, and getting caught, leaves me cold every time. Frasier does it, and it's not funny. Niles is perfectly himself - and is hilarious. Same comparison: Lucy/Dharma.
Actually, I think Dharma is a guys show, now that I think about it. Guys really do like women who don't pretend to be something they're not, of course, just so long as who they really are is interesting. Think about Tootsie - what did Hoffman learn about women? That they're better when they're strong.
154. CalGal - July 17, 1999 - 10:36 AM PT
No, I like Dharma's first few episodes as well. The first year was quite good; after that it went downhill.
David Hyde Pierce (Niles) is a comedy god. The man is flawless. And cute!
155. arkymalarky - July 17, 1999 - 10:37 AM PT
Adam,
What's funny is not that George is attempting to put something over on someone, it's that his motivation is always, first and foremost, self-interest. Which is more of what's true in human nature than most of us care to admit and adds to the humor.
I don't find the personality of Dharma's character real or convincing. I find it contrived. So when you say she's herself, the "herself" that she is annoys the crap out of me. I have watched that show several times and don't remember laughing even once.
156. CalGal - July 17, 1999 - 10:39 AM PT
Oh, now, see I find Dharma completely believable. In fact, on goofier days, I *am* Dharma.
157. arkymalarky - July 17, 1999 - 10:39 AM PT
I love Niles, too, and I think he works great with Frazier. But without Niles Frazier would probably not hold much interest.
158. AdamSelene - July 17, 1999 - 10:44 AM PT
Maybe its "a willing suspension of disbelief" - I really like the character Dharma plays, so I have no trouble seeing her as that character.
But people milking humor from human pathos just doesn't amuse me. I know, I'm not in the majority. I think the only episode of Seinfeld that I saw in it's entirety was the final one - and then only because I made myself do it just to see if I could figure out why everyone liked it so much. It didn't work.
159. CalGal - July 17, 1999 - 10:45 AM PT
Oh, Frasier can be damn funny by himself. It's just that his character isn't particularly likeable. But don't sell Kelsey short.
Besides, that entire cast is perfect.
160. arkymalarky - July 17, 1999 - 10:45 AM PT
I never saw the final episode.
161. arkymalarky - July 17, 1999 - 10:49 AM PT
No, I'm not saying Frazier isn't funny. I'm saying the whole show probably wouldn't hold up, at least not nearly as well, without Niles. The two together is the strong point of the show and a classic pairing, imo, though I agree the rest of the cast is good.
162. AdamSelene - July 17, 1999 - 11:04 AM PT
arky,
You're right - in fact, I'm not sure Niles could carry a show on his own either. For one thing, the writers would change him. TV leads have to do stupid things so that the audience can identify with them (I guess, I'm winging this analysis.) Which is why I think Dharma is going downhill --- the writers are regressing to the mean. By stupid things, I guess I really mean being deceptive. ya - that's it!
Luch hid her stunts, Dharma does them out loud and in public. George hid his true nature, and Frasier does too sometimes. (but not as much as other comic leads.) Niles, like Dharma, let's it all hang out in public - except for his infatuation with Daphne. But even then, he doesn’t actively try to court her with deception, as other sitcoms would have him do.
(Anyone else having trouble with the Slate website?)
163. judithathome - July 17, 1999 - 11:09 AM PT
adam:
Yesterday I had trouble getting what I clicked on...haven't checked it yet today.
164. Wombat - July 17, 1999 - 11:51 AM PT
The episode of Frasier when he and Niles bought a restaurant and attempted to run it had me laughing so hard that I thought I was going to have a heart attack.
Also the episode when Niles is "broody" and Frasier gives him a flour sack "baby" to take care of.
Literary humor:
SJ Perelman; James Thurber; PJ O'Rourke.
165. EricCartman1 - July 17, 1999 - 11:55 AM PT
Something about Jenna Elfman drives me up the fucking wall. Mugging for the camera is not acting, nor is it funny more than *maybe* once or twice. I've never been able to sit through an entire episode of D&G.
"South Park", as MsIT pointed out(!) is about the most consistently funny show on TV right now, plus it's thoughtfully subversive to boot, once you get past the fart jokes. (Which for some reason, I confess, I still find funny. You can't go wrong with fart jokes.) "Gilligan's Island" was never funny; like I alluded, it was all about Mary Ann. Maybe a parody movie could arise from that: "There's Something About Mary Ann."
"Frasier" was very funny the first two seasons, and still has the best comedic ensemble going. But the writing has gotten as stale as can be.
Adam: The great thing about "Seinfeld" was how venal the characters were. They were *all* anti-heroes, and yet, you could identify with their base motives. It's hard to pick a favorite episode; there's so many great ones. "Bizarro Jerry". "George Eats an Eclair from the Garbage". Any of them with George's insane parents.
Couple of very funny series that never got anywhere the credit they deserved were "The Larry Sanders Show" and the all-too-brief "Ben Stiller Show", which only lasted one season. HBO Signature runs "Larry Sanders" reruns daily, and they are truly amazing. Comedy Central used to show "Ben Stiller" reruns (there were only 12 episodes made), but they haven't been on for some time. Well worth keeping an eye out for; excellent sketch comedy, with Janeane Garofalo, Andy Dick, and Bob Odenkirk.
166. EricCartman1 - July 17, 1999 - 11:58 AM PT
Wombat:
Have you ever read Joe Queenan? He doesn't always hit his target, but is usually very funny, in a mean-spirited way.
I've always found Mencken and Twain to be almost painfully funny at times. Literary humor seems like a lost art anymore.
167. judithathome - July 17, 1999 - 12:09 PM PT
Joe Queenan is not only a funny writer but he is excellent in interviews. He has a quick-wittedness that can be lethal.
168. EricCartman1 - July 17, 1999 - 12:22 PM PT
Judith:
Yes, I've seen him on "Politically Incorrect" and "Conan O'Brien" before. He's an excellent guest. I liked the column he used to write for TVGuide too, "Average Joe".
I keep meaning to pick up "Imperial Caddy" (his book about Quayle), but have never gotten around to it. Have you read "If You're Talking to Me, Your Career Must Be In Trouble" or "Red Lobster, White Trash, and the Blue Lagoon"?
169. CalGal - July 17, 1999 - 12:34 PM PT
"The episode of Frasier when he and Niles bought a restaurant and attempted to run it had me laughing so hard that I thought I was going to have a heart attack."
I tell you, between your heart and your spleen, you'd best limit your comedy input.
That's a good episode. I also love the "Guy" skiing lodge episode, which takes bedroom farce three extra levels. And Frasier's final line is killer.
Literary humor a lost art? I dunno, Terry Pratchett makes me howl. Dave Barry is damn funny.
170. AdamSelene - July 17, 1999 - 1:10 PM PT
Eric,
"The great thing about "Seinfeld" was how venal the characters were. They were *all* anti-heroes, and yet, you could identify with their base motives. It's hard to pick a favorite episode; there's so many great ones. "Bizarro Jerry". "George Eats an Eclair from the Garbage". Any of them with George's insane parents."
Sorry. I guess I'm humor-impaired. Nothing funny to me about this stuff. "George does something stupid. Laughter. Almost gets caught. More laughter. Does something stupider. More laughter. Almost gets caught again. More laughter. Does something amazingly stupid. More laughter. Does Get caught. Outrageous laughter. Tune in again next week for 'George gets caught beating someone else's meat.'"
I mean - jeeze. I guit laughing at fart jokes about the same time I quit farting in public. I know I'm in the minority, but - hey - that's me.
171. EricCartman1 - July 17, 1999 - 1:11 PM PT
Dave Barry is funny. I've never heard of Pratchett.
172. AdamSelene - July 17, 1999 - 1:15 PM PT
My favorite Frasier episode was when he did the radio play, alienated everyone, and Niles ended up creating the voices in real time until he, too, got fed up - you have to see it to appreciate the perfect comic timing. I was rolling on the floor.
173. EricCartman1 - July 17, 1999 - 1:15 PM PT
Adam:
Different strokes, I guess. I admit, I am not a light comedy fan at all. I like satire, surrealism, absurdity, humor shot with a bit of nastiness.
For me, conflict is what makes great art, whether the art is comedy or music. Doesn't have to be *totally* nasty or mean, but at least a little something unexpected or a bit unsettling is a must.
174. EricCartman1 - July 17, 1999 - 1:17 PM PT
Grammer & Pierce do have some wonderful timing on "Frasier". Even the ones that are mediocre in their writing are always excellently acted.
175. judithathome - July 17, 1999 - 2:22 PM PT
Eric:
Sorry I didn't answer you earlier: I guess Dan Rather isn't quite as riveting as one would think; I have just awakened from an hour long coma or possibly it was a nap.
Yes, I've read Joe Queenans "Red Lobster...." but not the Quayle one. I love his assumed elitism....ha! I had the same thoughts about Banson, MO and what I call clone restaurants and Disneyland...fun for the masses but not for me.
He has sharp powers of observation. I think I'll check with Amazom to see if the Quayle book is available. I'll let you know if it is.
176. EricCartman1 - July 17, 1999 - 2:40 PM PT
Judith:
Hey, it's the weekend -- we get to take our time responding!(g) Watching Dan Rather....do you mean the search for JFK Jr.? Oddly compelling, except nothing's really happened yet, so we all feel gypped. I keep hoping they find 'em marooned on a small island out there (with Gilligan and the gang).
What I found funny about "Red Lobster" was that about halfway through the book, I realized that I not only felt the way he did about the "pedestrian" tastes in the mass market, but I also felt the same way about *Queenan's* tastes! I'm afraid I'm just not a Broadway fan.
If you haven't checked out "If You're Talking to Me" yet, know that it's funnier, and just as snarky as "Red Lobster". His takes on Mickey Rourke, Sean Young, Melanie Griffith, and Renny Harlin are especially priceless.
177. ACEofSPADES - July 17, 1999 - 5:34 PM PT
Re: Strangers with Candy
MsIT said she didn't see what the fuss was about with this show.
I feel compelled to respond, since I hyped the show earlier, based on a single episode (the retard episode).
While there are occasional funny moments on Strangers, the show is pretty lame, and has not again come within a hundred miles of equalling the Retard Episode.
The show may now be safely ignored. And I'm sorry if my gushing review has led anybody to try the show out. It's not that it's bad. It's just not all that good, either.
Although-- if you ever see a TVGuide description or commercial for an episode where Geri is asked to snitch on a classmate, *do* watch that episode. It's one of the funniest half-hours ever shown on TV.
178. PincherMartin - July 17, 1999 - 5:45 PM PT
Wombat --
"Literary humor:
SJ Perelman; James Thurber; PJ O'Rourke."
For literary humor, it's hard to beat Mencken, whose essays on America politics will sometimes leave me in tears.
The only other essayists who have anywhere near that effect on me are Vidal and (sometimes) Mailer. Mailer's funniest collection of essays was called _Pieces_, and it had a hilarious detailing of his spat with Vidal on the Dick Cavett show.
179. MsIvoryTower - July 17, 1999 - 7:47 PM PT
Message #177
Hahahaha, Hey Spade, you do guilt pretty good. Do you have catholicism somewhere in your background?
In any case, just to add to the heap, I actually *did* check it out because of your review here. I was, needless to say, less than impressed, but then, I didn't see that magical 3rd episode.
180. EricCartman1 - July 17, 1999 - 11:38 PM PT
If you receive the Food Network on your cable or satellite system, and you appreciate humorously bizarre (or bizarrely humorous, take your pick) goings-on, check out "Iron Chef", a Japanese show which has been syndicated to the Food Network on Saturday nights.
Combine "Enter The Dragon"-quality dubbing, goofy sports-style commentary, a small arena made to look like a giant kitchen, and some of the weirdest-looking food you'll ever see prepared, and you've almost got the "Iron Chef" concept.
As usual, one of Jon Carroll's old columns describes the show better than I can. If you have an appetite for the absurd, watch "Iron Chef"!
181. judithathome - July 18, 1999 - 1:33 PM PT
Eric:
I've ordered the Quayle book by Queenan...sort of; they are checking for it with their "sources" because it is out-of-print. I'm ever the optimist so hopefully will be reading it soon.
182. EricCartman1 - July 18, 1999 - 4:47 PM PT
Judith:
Great....please let me know if it's worth it. I can't imagine it not being hilarious. Queenan on Quayle should be downright brutal, like Mark McGwire playing tee-ball.
183. Rivendell - July 18, 1999 - 8:17 PM PT
this i sdivA, SHIT , IT'S NOT RIV.
fucking mac
anyway.
This is a comedy thread! post some penis jokesa, people!
riv isa trying to edit my posts for typos. WT F??????
184. Rivendell - July 18, 1999 - 8:20 PM PT
It seems Diva is auditioning for a chapter in the Quayle book.
(This really is riv, btw)
185. Rivendell - July 18, 1999 - 8:21 PM PT
Riv
Bite me.
youu know, a mkac isn't reallty a computer at all.
186. Rivendell - July 18, 1999 - 8:23 PM PT
Diva,
Hmmmmm.....
Ya'know you really should be careful what you say when you are no longer 800 miles away.
Oh, 'scuse the shit out of me. 893 miles.
187. Rivendell - July 18, 1999 - 8:25 PM PT
how sick is this, qnywqay?
and just how do you type on this keybaord?
Besides, slowly, i mean.
shit, tab into the pst button!!!!!!!!
188. Rivendell - July 18, 1999 - 8:26 PM PT
we need a hobby.
189. Rivendell - July 18, 1999 - 8:28 PM PT
it's a great need
190. Rivendell - July 18, 1999 - 8:33 PM PT
Since the "sparkling wit" seems to be in short supply here - let's try a quiz and see how long it takes anyone to answer.
(this is diva. here he is stressing over how to construct the fucking sentence. ARE YOU KIDDING? post the question.)
Earth gapes, hell burns, fiends roar, saints pray,
To have him suddenly convey'd from hence.
Cancel the bond of life, dear God I pray,
That I may live and say, "the dog is dead".
What's that from?
(now wasn't that easy?)
191. CalGal - July 18, 1999 - 8:57 PM PT
Richard III
192. EricCartman1 - July 18, 1999 - 9:04 PM PT
Shit, I was thinking "Cujo", maybe the final episode of "Rin Tin Tin".
193. cllrdr - July 18, 1999 - 9:22 PM PT
Slowly I turned. . . .
194. judithathome - July 19, 1999 - 7:13 AM PT
Riv or Div:
Isn't that from the original script of "Goodbye, My Lady"? Not a Raymond Chandler but the movie w/ Brandon DeWilde...
195. JJBiener - July 19, 1999 - 7:41 AM PT
Boy, I leave Riv and Diva alone and this is what they resort to.
196. PsychProf - July 19, 1999 - 11:53 AM PT
I find it a challenge to gauge the personal likes of the 40-50 fraybuds I send semi-daily e-mail humor to. "Who's on first" really cracks me up...over and over again...have a listen
197. ChristinO - July 19, 1999 - 12:57 PM PT
PP,
I thought it interesting that someone found your daily humor postings anti-male or disproportionately harder on men than women. I always found it a refreshing change that women for once don't take the brunt of the humor, but it ocurred to me that if the jokes were equally distributed that it might seem to bash men since they have historically taken less flack than women.
198. thoughtful - July 21, 1999 - 6:53 PM PT
I've started listening to books on tape on my commute to and from work, and I'm really enjoying it. Today I picked up Thurber. People think I'm nuts when I walk into work all cheerful and smiley!
Re economist jokes, there are more, many more than you think. See here.
199. FreetoChoose - July 22, 1999 - 6:30 AM PT
EricCartman1
Interesting timing. I almost never watch the food shows, but while channel surfing, I stumbled across the Iron Chef the other night. One of the judges was exclaiming about the ingenuity of the contestant using a blowtorch to singe the head of some fish. It was very weird.
200. EricCartman1 - July 22, 1999 - 11:25 PM PT
FTC:
Yeah, that was it! "Red Snapper Confront". Did you watch the whole thing? Amazing stuff. These two chefs, and their teams, spend an hour making a whole bunch of visually pleasing but utterly inedible crap. Then the "critics", generally Japanese soap opera actors, declare their vaunted opinions on the "food".
Extremely weird, but very funny, in a warped way. Part of the fun is the goofy voices they use in the dubbing. If you watched the whole thing, by the end you could anticipate the idiot on the stadium floor interjecting, "Fuku-san!" every 30 seconds or so.
"Iron Chef" is the most bizarre TV show I've ever seen. And I mean that in a *good* way, if that's possible.